Feb
21
A volunteer has created this video which illustrates the school situation.[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szVa32dOxWo&eurl=http://auroracitizens.com/[/youtube]
A volunteer has created this video which illustrates the school situation.[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szVa32dOxWo&eurl=http://auroracitizens.com/[/youtube]
Whether you agree or disagree with the levy I do think that it was in poor taste to use a student to make this video. It seems quite manipulative and exploitive. I would have preferred a teacher or administration narrating.
I also believe that much of the major upkeep issues (boiler, roof) should have been budgeted for all along. As a homeowner you know your furnace, water heater, roof, etc. will last “x” amount of years and you have to save for the inevitable. The same applies to businesses and schools.
Why do you think it’s poor taste to use a student? Who better to use than someone who experiences the daily problems students and teachers encounter in the schools. And manipulative and exploitive? That implies that the student doesn’t know any better. But these kids do and they see it every day.
As a homeowner I do know that my roof, furnace, water heater, etc. has a limited life but it doesn’t cost me $850,000 to replace my roof. Budgeting $850,000 isn’t a simple matter of major maintenance and upkeep, that’s capital improvement and that requires a lot more than just putting aside a little extra eggs and butter money each month in the savings account.
We are a country of people who want everything; quality services from our cities, states, and federal government — including quality schools, but aren’t willing to pay for it. Remember, we don’t invest money into our children’s past; we pay it forward.
It’s in poor taste because they are being used to do the dirty work of the school board and administration. Can’t get a levy passed? Let’s use the kids. It’s manipulative and exploitive for the same reasons. If the board and administration want it passed THEY need to get out and make their case. It’s THEIR job to get it passed, not the kids’.
As a homeowner you don’t have an annual budget over 20 million dollars either, with that kind of budget they can set aside a lottle extra eggs and butter money very easily. We do it as homeowners and they should do it. In fact according to one of the support websites they already have the money to replace the roof, they got it from the sale of land so the roof is now a moot point. Unless of course you like paying for things that are already taken care of. It’s inexcusable for the administration and board to have let the roof and boilers go for as long as they have. Especially the boilers that are 40 years old, there’s no excuse for that.
We in Aurora are absolutely willing to pay for quality schools, the evidence is how many people have moved here to take advantage of the schools we’ve been supporting all these years. However you shouldn’t confuse support with blind fealty, we expect our money to be managed well and as of lately it hasn’t been.
If we choose to make a stand on an issue such as this when we see excess and waste it makes the schools better not worse. New weight room, foreign languages for elementary school kids, new uniforms paid for by the schools and not the boosters, IB are all examples of what many of us feel are excesses and waste.
Over time, ongoing/preventative maintenance is usually cheaper than letting things go too long. The money that they could have saved by not “investing” in the press box, turf, and the moving of the road could have been used for maintenance of these mechanical systems. It is all part of fiscal responsibility. As a homeowner, if I sacrifice replacing my furnace because I want a new sportscar or plasma TV, I have no one to blame by myself. The same analogy can be made here.
This video illustrates the needs of the school system in a undisputable way.
I sarcasticly say–Poor exploited kids…”were they promised candy if they lied on the video”? Big meanies manipulating them, tricked them into supporting their school.
Ask the kids, the schools facilities are inadequate. Expanded curriculum is a good thing.
I went to the Aurora schools for several years. The condition of the schools then was no better (& possibly worse) than it is now. I remember as a kid them putting levies on the ballot (btw back then they mostly did not pass) and the staff constantly saying “if the levy doesn’t pass the sports will be pay to play” or “we won’t get to go to 6th grade camp” or any number of the other things. That is manipulative whether it is true or not. These issues should be between the schools and the homeowners and not using the kids to sell the parents. It would be different if the kids are complaining about the school without the coaching. I say they are manipulating the kids because they did it years ago and they are doing it now. That particular girl may or may not have been manipulated but it is in poor taste to put a student in the video.
Furthermore, I think a weight room and a band room and uniforms are all extras that should be purchased if there is a surplus. I agree also with sbpaur that they should have budgeted for the roof and boiler regardless of the price. Good accounting would provide for that in the budget over the course of years.
Ask the kids? Gosh do you think that if I asked them if they each wanted new cars they’d tell me “no we don’t need them”? Not likely.
I’ll stick to making determinations for myself. If you want to base your vote on what a teenager tells you they need that’s your problem.
This video is simply disingenuous. They imply that we do not have a band room; there is a large one, an auditorium with state-of-the-art acoustics and audio equipment. There is also a choir room which has two $10,000 Electronic acoutsic rehearsal rooms complete with a computer system to make it sound like you are performing in different acoustic environments. Do not tell me we need a band room I’ve been there, I’ve used them, the video is a misleading AT BEST. As for the condition of the other schools, yeah lets throw money at them instead of recognizing the mismanagement on the part of the President and Treasurer of the School Board who went ahead with costly projects under the arrogant assumption that Aurorans would blindly vote for another levy. Vote NO!
I’m surprised at how little credit you give to the members of this community if you believe that such a device will manipulate the voters. But what is manipulation? I have the courage to use my real name. I haven’t seen that from sbpaur, cheapskate, GLguy and longtime resident. What becomes more manipulative? Asking a student to speak about the problems in their school? Or hiding beyond a pseudonym to perpetuate damning and uninformed opinions? Courage to stand up and be counted for what you believe seems to be lacking in this forum, and on Cleveland.com.
But, let’s put all that aside and address some of the issues that have you most concerned. Now, mind you, I’m speaking only from my point of view and not that of the schools.
Yep, I don’t have a 20 million dollar budget; in fact, due to a layoff my household budget is a lot smaller than it used to be. I also don’t have a payroll and benefits to worry about. I don’t have to concern myself with the cost of a physical plant covering six buildings, 36 buses, and enough acreage for a small farm – oops, I’m wrong there, I do have to concern myself with the small farm but, unlike the schools, I can take advantage of agricultural incentives to reduce my costs. Hey, score one for me.
I also don’t have to concern myself with lousy, unfunded federal mandates, like No Child Left Behind that force more expenditures for school districts without – and here’s the kicker, giving them money to pay for it.
I don’t have to worry about lawsuits from parents because their kids aren’t my responsibility from the moment they step out of their yard, on every school day, until the moment they return back home – with the exception of those parents who drop off and pick up their kids every day. Have any of you done that? The roads and the parking are mess. They were designed for a small rural school district once more accustomed to cows and plows than Beamers and Lexus’. The new drive around the stadium, and the new parking lot have gone a long way towards alleviating some of the traffic problems but still isn’t enough.
I know physical education (sports fields, stadiums and weight rooms) seem silly to worry about – it was like that where I grew up. So many well-off people in that community pulled out their checkbooks and paid for it. Aurora sure seems to have a lot of well-off people hanging around maybe one of you pseudonyms out there know some, or are one, step up to the plate, get them to give back to their communities and take care of those expenses. In the meantime, bare in mind that physical education is as important in our schools as academic achievement. Take a look at the population around us. More of our kids are out of shape and becoming a big health and financial burden on our society.
In the meantime I know many people don’t read educational research, I figured that out by the responses. Physically fit kids tend to excel at academics. Physical fitness improves a child’s confidence, brainpower and long-term health – and that comes with indisputable evidence.
Further research points to the fact that music and art education greatly expands a child’s ability for abstract thinking way beyond many of the normal academic pursuits. Both have proven to be helpful with learning math and science.
I’m sorry that some don’t see the value of learning a foreign languages. Do you read newspapers? Do you watch the news? Do you wonder why the rest of the world thinks Americans are morons? It’s because we have a tendency to become insular and forget that there is a bigger world around us. Spanish is the fastest growing language in America, and is still one of the most spoken languages in the world. But maybe Spanish is worthless – Mandarin Chinese is the most spoken language on the globe with 1,051,000,000 plus speakers. China’s the big dog on the economic block and if we want our kids to compete globally than we had better start them real early at Chinese as it is the most difficult language to learn and write. And let’s not forget that many colleges are now asking students to have more than the two years of foreign language I was required to take back during the Bronze Age.
I am continually amazed at the comments concerning mismanagement of school funds. Can any of you seriously name any other funding more closely scrutinized than a public school’s? You might claim your own home budget but I doubt you have state and federal auditors looking over your shoulder. You think our public education is expensive? Why not travel to practically any other foreign country and look at what it costs to educate students there – in many countries most of our kids wouldn’t be educated beyond third grade because we couldn’t afford the cost.
SBPaur says, “Ask the kids? Gosh do you think that if I asked them if they each wanted new cars they’d tell me ‘no we don’t need them[’�] Gosh, do you think if I asked adults if they wanted to pay lower taxes they’d say no? Of course they wouldn’t. Nobody wants to pay taxes, let alone higher taxes, but that’s not the reality we live in. School funding is a big problem that will be with us for many years yet to come – for that we can thank the Voinovich and Taft administrations for doing nothing to solve the problem. Remember the pledge, “No new taxes?†That’s the politics of getting people to vote – the reality is we have to pay for the services we need and want.
I can accept community members not supporting the levy for a number of reasons – that’s the society we live in and I am thankful for that. But if you’re going to vote against the levy than do so with good sound reasoning and not some easy excuse with questionable validity. The past eight years has been rough on America and I don’t see the near future getting any better. We have a responsibility to take care of those who have come before us, and those who come after us. That begins at the local level. It has always begun at the local level, and it always will.
I’m not “hiding” behind a pseudonym Dave, at least not the way that you mean. There are nut jobs everywhere. I clearly express my personal opinion to my friends; however, I am not going to have some pro-levy zealot egg my house, key my car, etc. because I posted my name on a message board. I’d hate to think that an adult would do that but who knows about people these days.
You stated ” We have a responsibility to take care of those who have come before us, and those who come after us.” I couldn’t disagree more. We have personal responsibility in this world. I am responsible for my family and myself. I’m of the teach a man to fish vs. give a man a fish camp.
You are wrong in saying that because we don’t agree with the school’s plans that we don’t read education research. I strongly believe in art and music education; however, I do not think that holding the classes in a multipurpose area vs. a band room negates the benefits. No child becomes physically fit in gym class. That must be an extension of their home lives (again personal responsibility.) I do believe in foreign language classes and I do not believe in no child left behind (funded or unfunded.)
You want to fix all public schools and have them always run in the black without constant levies? Privatize them all! Privatized public schools have better test scores, better teachers and less financial waste across the board. When a company is running the school that can be fired they manage to successfully run a school system and within budget.
Way to go Dave Benson! I couldn’t agree more. However, I will state that I do and will use a psudonym on any forum for safety reasons.
I do not feel any student was “used” in creating a video. As a former AHS student myself, this might be a shocker, but I had a mind of my own…even in high school. Don’t discredit the students, that they don’t see the problems the school physically has, that they don’t see what needs to be fixed, that they probably feel cheated that they have to learn daily under some crazy conditions. What if you went to work each day to sit in a desk that dripped onto your head every time it rained? What if every hour, you had to pack up your files, phone, desk accessories, etc. and move to another part of the building…every hour, every day, 5 days a week? What if your car was packed to the roof with people every day coming and going to work due to lack of additional transportation? What if you had to eat lunch on your lap every day since there wasn’t enough room in the cafeteria?
Put yourself in their shoes–it doesn’t take a ROCKET SCIENTIST to figure it out, that students have ample reason to voice such an opinion and want to create a video to teach the public who is turning a blind eye to some real everyday circumstances. I certainly don’t agree with every decision the schools make, but I do not think they are asking for levy money to be frivously spent. For reasons I won’t get into here, my spouse and I keep close tabs on how money is spent in the district.
I also think it is ignorant to disregard the HUGE amount of positives to come out of this district the past 15 years without any increase in taxes. The schools were good when I attended, now they are state of the art excellent. I have lived here most of my life, I live here now for the schools for my children, and every week I see more and more names of alumni I went to AHS with who have purchased homes here for the same reasons.
And if you have a beef with the school board, goto a meeting and express it there(will you attend on Wednesday night to voice your concerns????? There is another Citizens Forum on 2/27 at 7pm at the high school gym., but stop taking it out on the kids. Contrary to belief they can think on their own and express their opinions too. No one is striving for higher taxes, but we cannot bury our heads in the sand either. It would be a shame to let many years of accomplishment and hard work dwindle away. See/hear you Wednesday, right???
You know very well why we don’t use our real names. We don’t want ourselves or our families to be harassed and we don’t want our property vandalized. And please spare me the that would never happen talk. There are people in this community who are nearly militant when it comes to supporting the schools.
As charming as your speech was it doesn’t seem to have addressed any of my concerns. Like why are we being asked to support a permanent levy? Why are they asking for more money than they need? Why, given the current economic climate, are we being asked to support non-essential perks? Why weren’t the needed repairs made long before now using funds that were apparenlty available to improve the stadium and move a road? Are those thing smore important than infrastrcture? Is it your opinion that they are? Why are they supporting the retention of IB but threatening busing? Why is nobody talking about holding anyone accountable for this financial fiasco?
These are but a few of my questions that never get answered. I have many others that will never get answered either, some that pertain to some questionable tactics used to get the vote out in favor of the levy. Tactics that were highlighted in a recent radio program. Tactics in fact that I find distrubing.
Lot’s of questions and yet nobody willing to answer them. Just flowery talk about supporting the future and not living in the past. Interesting
Greengal: I too went to the Aurora schools for 9 years. I don’t think they were that great back then. I had a good time in the schools but I didn’t think they were academically excellent. I found that in spite of my excellent grades in school that I was somewhat behind my peers.
You mentioned in another post that the reason people move to (or back to) Aurora is for the schools. Some do and some do not. I got out of college and lived elsewhere and after we had a child we moved back to Aurora. We did not move here for the schools. If we wanted to move somewhere for the schools we’d have moved to Solon, Orange or Chagrin Falls. We moved here because it is a smaller community where housing is reasonable, yards are larger and it is safe for children. I think it is ridiculous to think that people move to any city for only one reason.
I will vote no because I do not feel that the school system has managed the money they have well. I will not go to the meeting because I’ve already made up my mind. I support the children of this community (one of whom is mine) in many ways but will not support this levy.
Seriously. Militant Leviests? Are they the PLO? The Passage Levy Organization? If any one should be afraid of roving bands of unpoliced, militant factions it should be those who support the levy, after all, we still are in the minority. I’m sorry; I can’t accept the fear of reprisal from levy supporters for the use of pseudonyms. Reprisal is a cloth that cuts both ways and I stand just as much chance of it as do any of you. And quite frankly, I stand a better chance of winning the lottery than I do of a militant levy supporter harassing my family or damaging my property. Unless, of course, you now feel the need to pick up the gauntlet I’ve thrown down.
Heck yes, let’s privatize the schools. After all White Hat Management has proven what a success that venture is. White Hat Management runs 34 Life Skills Centers and Hope Academies in Ohio; only one has passed the standards, the others have failed. White Hat claims their failure is because they don’t get the quality students; they get the failures the other schools reject. Why if we were privatized it wouldn’t be the fault of the schools if our kids didn’t live up to expectations, it’s now the students fault. Privatization has been proposed for two reasons: converting to profit the 500 billion annually spent on public education; and to remove unions from schools. Where you stand on unions is of no relevance to this discussion; profit and loss are however. Under privatization your child is now a commodity subject to the same standards that rule a business. If there is no good return on investment, then something has to give until there will be.
Students with special learning needs would be cut out of the process under privatization. But what the heck, who needs a Thomas Edison, an Alexander Graham Bell, Henry Ford, Woodrow Wilson or General George Patton just to name a few. Privatization serves one purpose and one purpose only, profit. All else be damned.
Physical education, and by extension fitness, is not only an extension of the home life it is essential. But, then again, so is all education. But if I apply your logic to other areas of learning then why do I need proper science labs? Maybe inorganic chemistry should be an extension of the home lives, too – again stressing the personal responsibility. The weight room is but one small aspect of the overall physical education experience, and the whole body, whole student learning. The mistake made in the school video is that they showed a weight room instead of focusing in on physical education.
I won’t discredit any one on this forum for not teaching physical activity to your kids but if you do encourage them to get outside and get active, to pay attention to the foods the eat, to read the labels on processed food than I applaud you for joining me as being one of the few in America who actually do that. Statistically speaking, those numbers are shrinking every day.
I stated earlier that I’m not speaking for the schools so I can’t answer everything. Why not try calling the superintendent and ask him about your concerns, or maybe the treasurer? The phone number into the district offices is (330) 562-6106. Stand up. Be counted. Ask the tough questions and if they aren’t explained to you satisfaction ask for clarification. Don’t be fearful (I’m using the caps lock to emphasize this) THAT IS YOUR RIGHT AS A CITIZEN.
In truth we have both IB and AP and I don’t know why. I also don’t know a reason not to support them both. After the open meeting held at the high school auditorium I left and spent some time looking for facts about the IB program and, quite honestly, looking for facts to support dropping it. I couldn’t find any conclusive reasons not to support the program. Both IB and AP are meant for advance learning and both help students with college and graduate school in mind. If you can find any research, other than opinions, that show IB as an absolute and total waste than please bring it forward for all to see.
If all that you claim bothers you than step forward and demand an answer. That is your right as a citizen and a member of this community. There is another citizen’s forum scheduled for next Wednesday night, February 27th in the high school gym – be there, demand answers. But there are two things you have to keep in mind: 1. You will have to reveal yourself, 2. If you’re proven misinformed you have to be willing to accept the answers.
Now, I have to admit, the comment of non-essential perks really threw me. What kind of non-essential perks do you think are being employed through the schools? Let me try addressing this another way: when I was in school, back in the Bronze Age, there was a lot more expected of parents in terms of supplemental learning and discipline. Chances are the same occurred for nearly every person posting on this forum. Somewhere around 15 – 20 years ago (by my best guess) parents started abdicating their responsibility to the schools. We ask our schools to take care of everything when it comes to our kids; teach them how to balance a checkbook, teach them nutrition and health, teach them how to be good and responsible people. You might not have that expectation, I surely don’t, but you and I are in the minority. The rest of our population asks the schools to take on responsibilities that belong to the parents and that costs money.
Back when I was more involved with public education then I am now I listened to a friend go on about the schools one day, and how she was getting involved because they weren’t teaching her child right. I responded by saying, “Thank you for getting involved in your child’s education, now butt out!†My point, which I hope you can see, is that we have become more involved in our children’s education than we have in the past, but most of us don’t have the capacity, or inclination, to truly understand what it takes to educate a child (if you think you do then by all means, step up and take on a classroom for day). The truth is we have taken public education out of being a public policy issue and turned it into a political football. Think of that the next time you consider voting for a politician who is willing to spend an estimated $1 trillion on a war.
(Please stick your tongue in your check BEFORE you read this)
Well I’m voting for the levy.
After figuring I have been totally wrong all this time working out how to pay for the schools and how I can adjust my budget to afford everything asked for I’ve decided to work FOR the schools.
I’ll fill out an application to work for the school system so I can continue to get a nice raise, sweet benefits and loads of time off and all I have to do is be pro levy and not be one of those detractors that may question the policies, actions or outcomes.
I will be their biggest proponent and NEVER say anything negative about them and what they do. Besides all the bennies I won’t be ridiculed for hiding behind a pseudo name on these sites and once hired I will proudly post my name for all to see. People will revel in my dedication and conviction. Heck I may even be elected school board president.
So to all those out there hiding behind an internet ID I urge you to get hired at the school, this way we can pay ourselves and look good doing it.
Who wants to help me stick yard signs up?
The following was not meant to be posted as “anonymous” I simply forgot to fill in the info:
To Dave:
How ironic! The next Thomas Edison, Alexander Graham Bell or Woodrow Wilson you say? What about Mark Twain, Albert Einstein, Benjamin Franklin or FDR? Well, the future kids like those famous folks won’t have to worry about a levy because they were all home schooled!
In previous posts you mentioned US schools being behind that of other countries such as China. Here’s something you may not be taking into account or at least not mentioning here. Many countries (including China and India) do not have compulsory education through grade 12. The two countries I have just mentioned only require school for children through middle school and then there are only spaces for about 50% of the best and brightest to go on to high school. I certainly do not think the US should move to this system; however, if the schools only had to educate the top half of the kids they would all get a better education because there would be more money, more time and more resources per pupil.
You sited one poor example that is not privatization. You site White Hat and I can site K12. Both run charter schools in the state. K12 happens to be very successful in that pursuit and they are provided much less per student than their public school counterparts are spending. However, I am not speaking of charter schools. I’m talking about across the board privatization. In privatization they are forced to make and stick to a budget and if they are not getting the desired results with the students they will loose their contract. Since when is dollar-cost management bad and bigger government good? The bottom line is that the private schools such as US, HB & Laurel all do a stellar job educating kids without skimping on programs or rooms or repair of facilities; however, they receive less money per student than the public schools do? What is wrong with this picture?
“Most of us don’t have the capacity, or inclination, to truly understand what it takes to educate a child†Please speak for yourself. I am a teacher. I can figure out that the only 45 to 90 minutes of phys ed that are mandatory in Ohio schools per week are not enough to make a child physically fit. The government recommendation is 60 minutes per day. It would be impossible for the schools to give that much phys ed time; therefore, it is incumbent upon the parents to see this is accomplished. It is ridiculous to compare my saying that physical fitness is reliant to home life applies to the sciences.
“Think of that the next time you consider voting for a politician who is willing to spend an estimated $1 trillion on a war.†Careful Dave, your political slant is showing. That has nothing to do with this issue.
I’m not afraid of “militant leviests” and the word militant was someone else’s but it is internet safety 101 not to use your personal information on a public site. As I said, I speak to my friends about my opinion and I have talked to Russ Bennett and Jerry Brodsky before him without anonymity regarding my concerns with the Aurora schools.
To all the persons who are critical of the school board members and policies–
There is a meeting tonight (Monday) at 7 in Leighton School.
Show up or quite complaining
and to longtime resident and i quote you
“The bottom line is that the private schools such as US, HB & Laurel all do a stellar job educating kids without skimping on programs or rooms or repair of facilities; however, they receive less money per student than the public schools do? What is wrong with this picture?”
I reply– Bullshit!  University School receives millions and millions of dollars in gifts each year gifts for teacher salaries, the funding of chairs, gifts for capital improvements. Their fieldhouse was funded by a single donor who gave over $5 million. Their football field and track were privately funded by alumni and parents. They also have a $54 imillion endowment from which they receive income. They have a about 7 full time personnel in the development department alone. Their alumni are very supportive of the school and give back, without thier donations the school would not exsist. There is declining population in Cleveland in general, and the pool of students is shrinking. In addition the tuition for US is over $15,000 a year.
The best and brightest will leave Aurora school for these private schools without IB and improvement in facilities across the spectrum. I know this because my 8th grader is being recruited by private schools.
Dream on about your pie in the sky solutions, get real! our schools need the money just like we all need the money.
Glad you don’t teach my kids, or do you?
TO ALL
SBPAUR is going to sit in the hall for a couple days until he/she can get along with others. They know what i am talking about.
Or would you like to write “I will not attack others personally” on the blackboard 100 times?
or are you other readers amused by SBPAUR?
follow up: SBPAUR continues to write nasty replies… so not soup for you!
follow up:SBPAUR contines to be nasty what should i do with them? Explusion? Swats? Blacklist?
What makes you think I’d bother to sit in the hall or that I care about getting along with your ilk?
This conversation has deteriorated from discussing a video to an unfounded shouting match on both sides. I don’t think that anyone can denigrate the benefits that have been realized by some private institutions and charter schools. Likewise, it is irrefutable that Aurora is a standout public institution. The issue of the video ought to be the debate. On that note, this video was pretty misleading.
As for the discussion:
On the left of the political continuum, Benson will continue to argue for more funding. On the right, or perceived right, Longtime will continue to argue about accountability. Both are far from the debate at hand. Though I must say that I loved reading Benson stretch a debate about Aurora School Funding to a statement about the war… that takes some mental gymnastics.
Nevertheless, the original discussion about the video is valid. Having contacted some school players, they themselves admit that this particular student/parent duo stretched the argument in favor of the schools. I was reassured that leaks in a roof are not purposely going unattended.
On both sides of this issue there are people with good points. Both arguments are equally valid. However, griping about system mismanagement is just as unproductive as demagoguery about how more money is the solution to every problem. I can understand how Longtime would see little point to attending a meeting with public officials who have proven to have inflated egos. However, when it comes down to brass tacks, nobody is anti-children or anti-schools.
There is a substantive argument to be had about the method of funding, the long-term planning and the short-term management. There are also legitimate questions about the spending priorities of the Board. For example, IB. An intelligent debate would undoubtedly force School leaders into the uncomfortable position of defending a disproportionate expenditure of funds on a small minority of students. That explanation too, would involve some mental exercise. However, if the debate breaks down to name-calling and negativity, one can easily be marginalized and Board members can justify not responding to questions, no matter how legitimate.
If you want answers and accountability, it is important to keep the discussion intelligent and diplomatic. If you want more funding, you hardly do yourself or your cause justice by attempting to tie opponents to an unpopular war. Though I am not implying that I did, nearly 2/3 of Aurora supported Bush’s re-election, be mindful of your audience. Everyone should lift the debate. Vote on Election Day and make sure your like-minded neighbors do the same. Let’s have a great turnout and keep it legitimate. If we don’t, in the aftermath, someone will cry foul and we’ll have to debate this issue all over again.
I will not support the levy. I am certainly not a right-winger but I do not wish to be counted among opponents or supporters who sink to name-calling to win a debate.
No, people who vote against the levy are anti kids! They don’t realize the imact on those lives. Kids only get one chance in each grade and the cutbacks will hurt all the kids. Those voting against the levy are selfish and ashamed of themselves or they wouldn’t hide.
There wouldn’t be any vandalism of property, but those voting against the levy wouldn’t be very popular at the block party!
And let’s open the debate about that dimwit George W. Maybe that’s Auroras core problem, too many people here think he’s doing a great job!
I’m going to side with enoughalready and his/her point that this has gotten off track. I did have another reply written up but I’m going to shelf it. Oddly enough, I enjoyed the mental sparring more than anything else. And, in defense of myself, I will say this: I used the estimate of 1$ trillion on a war to illustrate a point, I failed to properly lay it out.
So here’s the point: More than 70% of Aurora’s funding is local. All Ohio schools rely heavily on local funding, some more, some less. Nearly all the mandates on public schools come from the federal or state level. Federal and state politicians ask for the most and support the least. When it comes to asking who’s wasting money and not using it wisely, you need to look at who is/are the worst offender(s).
A couple observations from the discussions I have been reading:
1. Voting a levy down will force school accountability?
All that does is reduce what we are able to offer to our kids. It really will not produce changes in adults, it just hurts the kids. No adult loses a company car if the levy is voted down, but the students all lose something.
2. Voting down a levy will keep us from “wasting” money on unneccessary frills?
What is a “need” vs. a “want” is always subject to opinion. But these are valuable conversations to be had.
Many would say that IB is a “want”, others would say that offering sports is a “want”. while others could argue that bussing is a “want”. It is all a matter of perspective. But these issues need to be handled by engaging in discussions.
Is IB a waste? Well, the objection from the beginning is that it is a large investment for a small portion of our students. Lots of effort, lots of work, lots of money. But is it worth it? Is it the right thing for our school? Ask 10 people knowledgeable with the program, and you will likely get a list of pros and cons, without 100% agreeement on whether it is right for our school. It is one of those things we’ve managed to be able to offer to produce high student achievement.
3. The real question is do we want to be the 17th highest-achieving school of the 622 in Ohio? So far, we’ve been achieving at a level higher than our spending should dictate. $9100 per student should not by all rights place us in the top 17 Ohio schools. Do we want to stay there? If our community decides “yes”, than “fringe” programs like IB should stay because offering the program is good for our students. Necessary? Not for an average school. But necessary to achieve at these levels? Yes.
4. I am no money expert, but it seems hard to complain about how money is spent when the priority is student achievement, and we have found ways to achieve in the top 3% while spending closer to 50-60% of what ohio schools spend per student. Are we really that upset about not being in the top 2%? Really? That’s like complaining about your kid’s study habits because they study in different ways than you would expect, but yet they get straight A’s.
5. If the community truly decides that Aurora should spend an “average” amount on its students, then it should be willing to accept an “average” school. If the high achievement levels are really not worth the additional taxes necessary to make it continue, then I can accept that. But the impression I get from most here is that they feel it necessary to cut funding and then blame the impending achievement drop on how the money is spent. Makes no sense to me.
6. Do we need upgrades to accomodate the growth in the number of students? To stay at the top, yes. Unless you believe class sizes of 35 are just as quality as class sizes of 25 for your students. Necessary? It depends on the quality of school you want.
At least at the High School, we are clearly out of space, and looking at more incoming than are graduating. But voting the levy down will sure show those administrators.
7. As for extra-curriculars, again it is a matter of opinion. Are sports and band as important as academics? No way. But do we want our to have these options available and have them be quality? You decide, and voice your opinion. That is not just an “only at levy time” issue. If you feel funds are mismanaged because we spend on sports and band, go argue your point at board meetings. Whether we have a levy pass or not, where we appropriate money is always an important issue. If you are satisfied with well below-average sports facilities and extra-curricular programs, speak your mind.
Questioning how public money is spent is always fine. But cutting funding because you disagree with decisions doesn’t fix it. If we were spending $15,000 per student and want to say “enough is enough”, that is one thing. But we are clearly not spending enough on our students to justify the expectations we have for them and our schools.
I really like AHS23’s take on things. There really is nothing wrong with an average school, I feel AHS was average, maybe a bit above, when I went there. And I think I turned out nicely! :) And I doubt the schools will collapse if the levy is voted down.
That said, I’m still voting for it. I just don’t think Aurora has all that much to offer other than the schools. I mean, no direct freeway access, no rec center, a so-so library, not a lot of options for dining…so to me personally, keeping the schools better than average is worth it. I feel that Aurora has a nice “brand” so to speak, but that if you ask someone from out of state, why would they move to Aurora vs. say, Twinsburg? The only answer I can come up with is The Schools.
I would never begrudge anyone who intends to vote no, can’t even disagree w/all their points. (I mean, really, IB? I only had 2 AP classes available to me and I still got in early to Miami U.) But, again, when it comes down to it, for me, I just feel it’s a good investment.
Other than the schools, the only thing that differentiates Aurora is the almost 100% european-american population. Few minorities. Some people like that, others don’t.
Oh yes and we have two gazebos, most cities only have one.
Seems like nothing inflames the masses like a school levy. I agree with the above posts, Aurora really doesn’t have much else to distinguish itself other than the Schools. I personally think this present levy shorts itself. Truth be told, a brand new school should be built. I think the projected increase in enrollments is on the low side as manifested by the bulge seen in the lower grades/proposed increase in housing. To me it’s unconscienable that the citizens of Aurora don’t financially support the Schools the way that our neighbors in Hudson, Chagrin, Solon, and yes, even Twinsburgh do. I think the School Board suffers a PR problem in that the only voice we here is by design the Board President’s (speaking for the Board). I personally would like to hear a little Board dissention and individuality (or are they ALWAYS in aggreement about every issue). What was said earlier is true, mediocrity or excellence? I certainly hope the latter is chosen.
I am not saying that I would never under any circumstances vote for a levy. I will say that I will never under any circumstances vote for a levy that has no end. I hope that if this levy fails next week for the second time that the school board will not act like this is the end of civilization as we know it but first get their current budget in order and prioritize their spending and then come back to the people (if necessary) with a levy with a beginning and an end and with accountability.
Everyone needs to get out there and vote, not just this election but every election.
Get involved, volunteer, go to school board meetings, run for school board if you think you have the answers, participate on committees, etc, etc, etc….
It’s easy to sit back and criticize but if you aren’t participating in this community then stuff will happen that you think is stupid or you just don’t get. Be part of the action!
And if the snowbirds didn’t vote absentee then that’s irresponsible on their part!
If the city haden’t offered so much tax abatement to businesses to fill their own pockets, the schools would have much more money!
So now the city runs a 4.5 million surplus and the schools are hurting.
The business get tax abatement and then leave town when the agreement is about to run out, violating their agreement and the law department doesn’t go after them.
McMaster Carr how much abatement did they get?? Or that new medical company or the Chineese lightbule warehouse?????
To those who have been following the fireworks at this thread, there is a new posting from Dave at the Olive homepage. Actually, he sent it on the 24th or 25th and i didn’t post it till now.
Posting and comments are much quicker if you sign up as a registered user.
I am not voting for the levy. I have several issues and I will try to address them here in separate posts as not to ramble on.
My first major concern is with the quality of leadership we have today. When Dr. Costanza retired, the ABOE president assigned his wife to be the secretary to the superintendent so he could keep an eye on the superintendent. This spying does not foster an open and honest dialog amongst staff when everything they say and do is reported to the ABOE president.
The ABOE fired the treasurer – actually it was a $125,000 buy out. This treasurer had been recognized for excellence by his peers. Yet because he was honest and would not rubber stamp the superintendent and ABOE president’s flights of financial fancy he was removed and replaced with the purchasing manager. One can only assume the line is being toed by the current treasurer.
The ‘search’ for the newest superintendent was fixed from the beginning. The ABOE decided not to use a professional search firm, but to do it themselves. A requirement in the search descriptions was the new superintendent had to start work January 1, 2006 while all school employment contracts run from July 1 through June 31. This eliminated any superintendent that was under contract, leaving the under employed or an individual whose board would gladly release from their contract. Surprisingly, they found few ‘qualified’ applicants and chose Mr. Bennet who had just received his superintendent certificate in May of 2005. At the last minute they decided to allow the new person to start on July 1, 2005 because Mr. Brodsky was going to use sick leave to be paid from July 1 through December 31, 2005 and effectively retire on June 30. This is something the ABOE knew from the start yet chose to not disclose.
The board new they were facing tough financial issues. Yet they chose two inexperienced individuals to run the system. They should have done the job properly and hired the most qualified individuals in the state.
So run for the board, go to a meeting, volunteer, get involved in a positive way. Voicing your opinion here a good start but voicing it at a face-to-face is much better.
I am glad Russ Bennett, a product of Aurora schools is the superintendent. He is an excellent person to lead the district. I would not have wanted a state-wide search for a candidate from outside the district. i like this outcome.
I didn’t hear any criticisms of anyone until this levy went on the ballot, your reasoning hurts only the students and the teachers.
I wouldn’t assume anything about the finances, go in and look at the books, you can. And i think your opinion is wrong about other personnel issues too.
But truthfully i didn’t pay much attention to any school board issues.
Your argument is water over da damn dam.
Olive:
I know Mr. Bennett is a nice loacl guy. As a taxpayer and former employee of the school system,I want the most talented and experienced team available to lead our schools.
This is a $20,000,000 per year operation. The criteria for its head should not be that he is local and a nice guy. This type of ‘comfortable’ thinking does not treat the taxpayers fairly.
Parker
Olive: actually it’s $24,000,000 but who’s counting… and voting against the levy will what? send a message? will your message change anything anywhere? the last vote was a wake up call for everyone, that sent a message.
why not vote for the levy and then get involved in a committee or something? or go to every meeting and pore over all the finances? As a former employee your input would be usefully if you really want to help, not grind your ax. Thanks for your comment.